So just exactly what are you trying to say Jack?????

__________________
Insert witty, comment here............

If you can run faster than 1950 feet per second
feel free to help yourself to anything I own!!!

I think He means you could lose some Weight,,,,,lmao,,,,

Rabid!!!! I quit 10 years ago and was 160lb,,now 210 alday long,,,, but still feel better,,,lol,,,good luck with the smoking,,,, and merry xmas,,kenny

Thanks Ken, I think I was 160 in high school, been around 195 for the past few decades, don't plan on getting any bigger either, and the way things are right now it doesn't look like I will be losing any this week!!!! Merry CHRISTMAS to you and yours as well.

__________________
Insert witty, comment here............

If you can run faster than 1950 feet per second
feel free to help yourself to anything I own!!!

I don't know the exact figures for those 2 engines, but most modern piston ports make around 24 hp on gas rigth out of the box with the vevey pipe and the walbro W2A carb, a virtue of this JICA piston ports is an amazing ability to rev as high as 20.000 and survive, I used to race a PCR JICA and loved it, very tricky to tune and drive, not much low end and stumbles easily if you smash the gas too quickly, very fast motors.

the PV92 is one homologation older than the JICA's we have here but should be much faster and reliable than a yamaha, and for $600 I'll buy 2 of them and race duals, leave them stock and you'll enjoy them for years.

almost forgot, yes about the sudam cases with fins.

Augusto.

Trying to say? nothing other than hinting that the bigger reed assy. might not guarantee a better running engine, what did you read into it?

are you "implying" that I may have gained some weight??????? RFLMSAO

__________________
Insert witty, comment here............

If you can run faster than 1950 feet per second
feel free to help yourself to anything I own!!!

I saw a picture of a kart with 3 rear wheels once...

was it for "heavy weight" drivers?

I think it would be cool a "dually" kart

no, no, not diesel powered....yet!!

an air horn would be great for passing...lol lol..

Augusto.

Not an implication, just a matter of fact that my newer Sudam don't make as much power as the one done by Super Dyne, and the K-35 used to be super strong, plus who am I to imply that anyone else should loose weight? I know exactly how impossible it is to loose weight perminantly, 25+ yrs. of working in candy factories allowed me to get about 65 lbs. heavier, real easily....First 3 wheel kart I ever saw was at Shellheimers Speedway in Pa.,early '80's, Carl Newman, 3rd. wheel was in center of axle, 150 TKM open engine power, asked him, he said, no good, 'cause it'd hit a high spot with the center and spin the tires, he'd just not gotten around to removing it.

Apples and oranges. The newer one if it's box stock probably makes less power than every alky 116 ever built, but is an awesome motor nonetheless. Apples to apples....Have the same work done to both motors. I know the first new-new-style sud kermit built he said 'this made more power than all others' according to the purchaser. To your point Jack about the old style it's really nitpicking as they are all capable of making huge HP, and are probably between 2-3hp of each other in the end? That could be 1/8th turn on the hi side at 15k.

6 bolts, nuts and washers plus .010" less on the springs ain't nit picking to some of us.

I just found a liquid refrigerated 125 sudam . How much would this cost in US? And where .Here's a link:
http://www.birelargentina.com.ar/
Click on motores...

swimdle. got a tkm on trade 100 dont know nutting about,mag no 100.00 john

John, Do you think the bottom end is ok? Does it have a carb? I do have a few spare coils and mags, I could put on it. Is it a right side motor, I guess that would be clockwise?

Hey Jack, I think Carl ran that axle with the center wheel on in through the 90's. Especially if someone with dual showed up and he had to dump the nitro to it. He knew how to keep those tires sized right so it kept diggin. But like you said, He would say how if you hit the berm or a bump they wouldn't hook up. The Man could Fly!! Steve Windle Sr.

Since this motor is not allowed here it's not for sale, I have no idea about price

the 95 is available here for $ 2.080 with HL334 and vevey pipe, last time I quoted was like 3 months ago.

it's getting scarce because the nationals switched to the rotax FR125 because of a nice factory support.

but the sudam is much faster, here in Loja the rotax didn't catch any fans, it's 2 seconds slower, last saturday the regional champion brought one here but was disapointing, last saturday we had a 1/2 hour race with mandatory pit stop and refueling, was quite interesting, and very fun, the press called it mini F1.

Augusto.

why is the 98 not so good

I'm not totally sure but I think I've seen some older Sudams, at least the head and jug looked like older ones, that have finned cases that look just like the 2001 models.

You can weight a few months and decide on if the BRC150WW is what you want....It is stock with 150cc's and liquid cooling. The reed cage is the latest Euro evolution as well. The cylinder is 5 intake ports and 3 exhaust ports. Can be custom ordered with 2 x MAG crank halves or standard direct drive type crank halves (1 x MAG and 1 x PTO).

You can see the thread here: http://karting.4cycle.com/showthread.php?t=278926

Target price is $2800.00. I will be posting performance specs as they happen. The cases are being machined next week.

Here it goes, a link to the official Iame web from Italy.

http://www.iame.it/

The 85cc Puma is being used in Europe by the CIK/FIA as the substitute to the previous cadet class ran with 80cc Comer. In my opinion it is a mistake because they are too fast for some of the young kids and at some tracks their lap times are very very fast. I was helping someone last summer with the setup and as I told you they are to fast, though some of those little kids have already a wide experience at the highest level.

I agree with you, here the 85cc comers run the same lap times as the 60cc easykart which is just like the Puma but smaller, I bet the Puma is a fast mother for a youngster, I wouldn't be comfortable with my kids running a powerful engine.

Augusto.

Right Augusto, but everything comes from comercial interests, so they moved from Comer to Parillas. Now I never saw Sudams in Europe, the 3 classes in the 90s were the ICA (100cc direct drive) JICA (Junior class, 100cc with a clutch), Cadet (Comer 80cc), ICC (125 shifters), Superkarts (250cc) and finally Super A (100cc rotary admission for drivers who had already won competitions, usually national and world champions). In some places they have a class for the 5 and up years old with Comer 50cc.

of course Santiago, you will not find Sudams in Europe, this is a class born and made for South America, hence the name SUD-AM-erica (south america for non spanish speaking fellows), it's based in CIK/FIA intercontinental C class but adapted to the style of the south americans, originally the motor was conceived to be run on alcohol, ethanol especifically since this is the main fuel in Brazil, in the USA is used with methanol, in the rest of the countries down here is used with gasoline. IAME has a factory in Brazil IAMESUD where this engines are built, they also have a branch in Argentina. Not all the Sudams are made by Parilla, I've seen them from PCR, CRG, Italsistem (Varasud) and Riomar.
the Sudam class is king here in the south, most countries have it, of course Brazil has the vast majority, then is Argentina, Chile, Ecuador,and Colombia, Peru is mostly Yamaha but they do have Sudam classes, the rest of the countries including central america and Mexico also are big fans of the great 125cc engine, then somehow it ended up in the USA where I can see has lots of fans, and for a good reson, have you driven one? they're great.

Augusto

No, I haven't driven one, but I guess sooner or later I will. That's a great info, because I'm going to run 2 cycles on dirt now and I have been watching these engines around but I had no idea where they came from. It would be interesting to take one to Spain with the dual carbs. By the way, some of the lap times of the Pumas 85 driven by little kids can be compared to the times we put in the 90s with the direct drive air cooled 2 cycles since their chassis are much better and faster, so you can imagine how fast they are. Besides they add an extra difficulty fot little kids, that is finding the right carburation while they drive, too much to handle for such an early age. Comers were good for that age.

Yeah, would be cool to take a built 116cc reed/rotary over there and run against the TAGs/ICCs, much less a 131 sudam. I wish the local sprint track by me had some sort of mild open 2-cycle class, or even RWYB.

rotary formula A engine class did not succed here and faded away pretty fast because they couldn't keep up with the sudams, in Cuenca where they started racing FA's, the very best drivers turned laps in almost the same times as the sudams but the engines were in the 20.000 r's while the sudams were turning 16.000, the pistons and bearings of the FA's wore out pretty soon and the drivers didn't like that, also they were much harder to drive because extreme finesse was required, the minimal mistake throws you to the back of the pack and there is no way to go back, with the big torque of the sudams it is possible to recuperate after a mistake.

a class that was quite popular on the other hand was the piston port which used direct drive JICA engines, no clutch allowed, those engines by PCR and Parilla was awsome, very fast and almost indestructable, pefect entry level class, it destroyed the K55 class, but finally all of them sucumbed to the sudams, today only the Rotax has challenged the sudams not becuse the engine is great (actuallly few drivers like it) but for the excelent track support and competitivines of the class, also the long durability of the engine is very much appreciated, but purist like me... SUDAM or bust!!! mi amigo.

Augusto.

" Viva Sudam"." Y no fuma jerba".

augusto, I have a JICA air cooled engine in Spain, a Comer, and it was built so good that is even faster than most ICa I have had. The JICA was sweot in Europe by the cheapest prices of the Yamaha class (I forgot to name that class), since the JICA had a more expensive clutch and needed a hand held starter that were very expensive in Europe. My JICA is a Comer, got it from a driver who has been an F1 Test Driver and has driven many seasons the GP2 and Nissan series, Adrian Valles. I think is the best built engine I have ever had, it had some excellent work on the piston too when I got it first, reliable because I always try to run them rich when I practice for fun, and JICAs were not supposed to go over 16000-1700 rpm since they had some air intake restriction to limit their performance (they are actually like ICAs) and also the Walbro carb adds to this limitation. I didn't modify mine and left it as I got it, just as a legal FIAA JICA, but it's faster than most ICa I had. Most JICAs used to be very well built because the class was only run by some of the best young drivers or those who had more money or were factory drivers. The rest joined the Yamaha till JICA finally dissapeared and was replaced by Yamaha and then Junior Rotax. I really think some of the best Super A would be able to keep with some Sudams, I have seen them been faster than the ICC, you have to consider that the Super A (FA) in Europe were only driven bydrivers like Fernando Alonso and those who had been National champions or World or European, or Asian champions, so very few were built but they were built by the best people from IAME, Vortex, PCR, etc.

Of course the JICA were piston port, while the ICA were reed, but still very similar engines.

I still have two JICA PCR engines one has the red anodized head and the other the natural aluminum, I love them, too bad there is no class to race them anymore, we got them from the factory withthout clutches, they came with a short snout crank ready for the pinion, used the same ones as the IAME engines, the WB2 carb is much better and bigger than the yamaha's and is tuned with the low speed needle, we used them with the vevey pipes from the factory and turned 18.000 rpm with no sweat, never seen a rod failure, actually I never changed a rod from any of them in 3 years that the class lasted and I was the only one who serviced the PCR brand, and as far as I know the parillas didn't failed also, but the PCR's were always faster, this class was killed by the sudams.
I have always wonderer why this engines didn't replace the yamahas in the USA, lots of explanations but still does not make sense to me, 24 hp out of the box in gas, no blueprint needed..c'mon what is it with the yamaha?... maybe the builders never allowed an engine which was not profitable for them???... hmmm maybe I wouldn't also if I was one.

Augusto.

In Europe the ones we drove without clutch were the reed valve, the 100cc ICA direct drive, very fast, VORTEX were probably the fastest, but Parillas were more reliable and cheaper for parts. Mine was an IDK, made in Spain by Arisco, a chassis manufacturer, and one of Fernando alonso's mechanics used to say that they were actually faster than the Parilla's, but at least during the years I raced mine wasn't, even if it was a very reliable engine, very few times I blew it, usually once a season, and that was good considering that at the level of those FIA championships everybody had to run them the leaner we could to get the maximum out of them. We didn't have many problems with rods, in fact I think I only changed the rod once just as a preventive measure. My IDK, that I just brought to the US, had a double ignition and 2 spark plug, and the head was pretty big. JICA was a clas only for young drivers, just immediately before they moved to adult classes, and the top class was the ICA 100 direct drive, since the more competitive drivers raced there. It was a great show, specially when we raced in the streets and they closed the streets, with not much time for practice and the asphalt without much grip since it wasn't as cleanand levelled as the permanent roadcourses. I also remember camping at the tracks and spending the whole weekend there, 2 days practice, one day race, and sometimes 300 miles driving back home, no trailer, kart on top of my small Fiat Uno and one set of tires to fight against drivers who changed piston after every single race, had several engines, factory support, several chassis, many sets of tires, paid mechanics sometimes brough mechanics from Italy (like IAME or other factories)... It was a different time.

one set of tires and the rest you said is exactly the way we still do it here, when we go to the nationals we face guys that had entered 2 chassis and 3 motors, the max permitted by rules and change tires between heats, me and my friends arrive with one old chassis a set of tires left from the last race and an old sudam friend that still pulls hard, feels so good when we beat them rich guys. it's great..!!!

but I have never seen a kart on top of a Fiat Uno.... ha ha ha, that must be something, got any pics? should be fun, I have this book with the pic of a kart stuffed in the rear of a Pinto... and looks so funny.

I have always used trailers... made by myself of course...

Augusto.

Yes,Augusto, "unfortunately" I have embarrasing pictures that prove I started racing on a very very low budget, lol. Part of the story comes from that time, I used to do good when it rained because you didn't need so much power and older chassis were better under the rain because they were less wide, but were very bad on a dry track because they were too tight compared to the more modern chassis at that time. I have pictures but they are in Spain, but promise to try to find them next summer when I get there. I also hadd some of my first races in the US at Langley Speedway, instead of the Fiat Uno I used a 626 Mazda to carry the kart on the top. My trailer era started on the SC dirt tracks, first open trailer and then the enclose I still have, a 6x10 feet that is small compared to most of the big guys' but was enough while I had only one chassis. Now it is a little more complicated owning more chassis.
In Spain there is no way you can compete with older stuff, at our road courses it is much slower and sometimes FIA/CIK doesn't even compete because homologation is gone for them. Besides all this you need some of the good engineers from the factories with you to win, and bringone of that guys from Italy is not either easy nor cheap, unless you get support from Genis Marcoin the Barcelona area, the guy that made of Alonso such a good driver, but it is very difficult to get his help. When he is at the Nationals you just see him on top of the trailer watching his drivers and giving orders to some team members about what they should tell the kids to do (most times young promising kids, or rich ones like Carlos Sainz Jr, the son of the great World Rally champion Carlos Sainz). If they don't do as what they are supposed to do they won't last much there, doesn't matter how good they are. I have a friend that raced one National with him and was more agressive than required when he was running for 3rd dissobeying team orders and he has never been with Genis anymore.

I think you would enjoy south american karting, rules are loose or non-existant and most deal only with the engines and tires, we have never ruled chassis and people get to race with whatever they find, as long as the engine fits the class you are ready to go.

hey those embarrasing pictures are the best, you should of seen the way we started racing here, no money, no tech, no knowledge, no track, no tires, and old motorcycle engines, I will never forget the first time we raced in Cuenca where there was a real track (we only did street races then) an we made fools of ourselves, they let us organize a class for our karts alone and after 7 laps of the first heat not a single kart of the 12 that entered the race remained racing, all had to abandon due to engine failures or other bloopers, nobody even completed 50% of the laps so there was no winner. this friend lost the STEERING WHEEL during cornering and ended upside down, it was so funny, I lost the fuel pump and my engine quit, my brother's fuel tank split in 2 and lost all the fuel, it was complete chaos, the public laughed so much, we packed our stuff and returned home so ashamed but determined to go back and kick a$s, we did 6 months later and got lots of aplauses.

Augusto.

When I raced at Langley Speedway in VA rules were much more loose, just a group of people racing an open class together, and we used tolaugh at howpeople ended in discussions or close to fight in other classes while we had fun and help each other. That's probably the best group of people I have ever raced with, I still see Troy Blanton from time to time when I visit the area. Great guy and great driver!