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  #1  
Old 11-01-09,, 01:18 PM
gx200honda gx200honda is offline
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gx200honda
fuel additives

what can you put in your fuel to give you more power?
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  #2  
Old 11-01-09,, 01:52 PM
tlizard tlizard is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Nitromethane, but you don't really want to go there, you'll likely break a lot of parts. You could convert to run alcohol, but you need to build the engine to take advantage of it, then your stuck always using it.
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  #3  
Old 11-01-09,, 01:57 PM
gx200honda gx200honda is offline
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Re: fuel additives

we thought of nitro. why does it brake parts?
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  #4  
Old 11-01-09,, 04:29 PM
greasemonkey85 greasemonkey85 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

alot of 2 stroke guys use nitro around here. i dont know how to use it. some guys use polypropolene and some (long time ago) ran liquid ether to, but both of those are pretty nasty chemicals and need special foam additives in water to put them out when they are on fire....
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  #5  
Old 11-01-09,, 05:15 PM
Kart43 Kart43 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Most tracks will ban you if not they should. The fumes other competitors have to inhale are bad enough.

Leave the chemistry alone.
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  #6  
Old 11-01-09,, 05:46 PM
gx200honda gx200honda is offline
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Re: fuel additives

what do you think to octane booster?
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  #7  
Old 11-01-09,, 08:47 PM
racing75 racing75 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

waste of money
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  #8  
Old 11-01-09,, 09:24 PM
Kart43 Kart43 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

You use octane booster when compression is too high for the fuel you can purchase. They do not give you power.

You will get to where you want with engine tuning a lot quicker than trying to buy a magic pour in power additive.
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  #9  
Old 11-01-09,, 10:16 PM
DadOf3 DadOf3 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

I have used and had small gains with the Klotz Nitro fuel additive.
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  #10  
Old 11-01-09,, 11:22 PM
65ShelbyClone 65ShelbyClone is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Quote:
Originally Posted by gx200honda
we thought of nitro. why does it brake parts?


For the same reason it makes more power: increased cylinder pressure. Nitromethane is a rocket fuel that is only marginally suitable for piston engines. On top of that, people who experiment with it often do not properly richen the mixture, so the engine runs lean and gets nuked.
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  #11  
Old 11-02-09,, 12:10 AM
Oldschool Oldschool is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Quote:
Originally Posted by 65ShelbyClone
On top of that, people who experiment with it often do not properly richen the mixture, so the engine runs lean and gets nuked.





Me the G200 and the Summer of 86......

BOOM!
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  #12  
Old 11-02-09,, 07:46 AM
greasemonkey85 greasemonkey85 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

from what i was told.....

gas has a quick flash point so when the spark plug fires it it only burns for a short while down the power stroke

methanol is alot better and burns longer and forces the piston farther down the cylinder

and nitro is the best. it is still burning out the exhaust....


i dont know if this is true, but that is how it was explained to me.
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  #13  
Old 11-02-09,, 10:48 AM
Kart43 Kart43 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Methanol is much harder to ignite than gasoline and burns at a much slower rate. Methanol also burns cooler, releasing its energy at one-fifth the rate of gasoline.

You produce more power because you are burning more fuel, CH3OH(Methanol) is ran at a much richer mixture 5:1 or 6:1 by weight.

Methanol has approximately 9,500 BTU/lb.
Gasoline has approximately 18,400 BTU/lb.
Nitromethane has an energy content of 5,000 BTU/lb.


But we put a lot more Methanol to the engine than gasoline.

And the ratio of Nitromethane is 1.7:1 therefore we are putting that much more fuel to the engine again.

A little nitromethane poured in your gasoline should not show any improvement in performance.
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  #14  
Old 11-02-09,, 01:11 PM
greasemonkey85 greasemonkey85 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

What about some in methanol? is it worth it it?
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  #15  
Old 11-02-09,, 01:24 PM
65ShelbyClone 65ShelbyClone is offline
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Re: fuel additives

I would like to clear a few things up; methanol has a higher flame speed than gasoline and a lower ignition input energy, so technically it is easier to ignite with a spark, at least at stoich mixtures. It does have a lower flame temperature, but it is only marginally lower than gasoline. The big deal is that methanol has a higher octane rating which means it is harder to make autoignite(ping, "detonate") from heat and compression alone. Also, the latent heat of vaporization is high which is responsible for the significant cooling effect on the induction system. The flash point is only ~55°F whereas gasoline contains compounds that flash from anywhere around -40 to 400+°F. This has more to do with cold starting than anything.

http://www.whitfieldoil.com/www/doc...-race-fuel.html

http://www.faqs.org/faqs/autos/gaso...art4/index.html

As far as adding nitro to methanol, that is how it's usually done. I don't know what proportions are "safe" vs. most rewarding, but I do recall that the risk increases on a much steeper curve than the benefits...
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  #16  
Old 11-02-09,, 02:43 PM
Michael Jackson Michael Jackson is offline
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Re: fuel additives

This web site will explain what you are looking for, however you may want to proceed is up to you. It doesn't mention about oil enhancers(nitro) but that is another way to make power. You can make some power with additives and a stock motor but it is limited somewhat. If it didn't work why would we have fuel checks at the races?

http://www.turbofast.com.au/racefuel12.html
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  #17  
Old 11-03-09,, 12:22 AM
grits grits is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Nitromethane brings it's own oxygen to the party. This allows you to not depend, totally, on the carb supplying all the air. Perfect for applications where the carb is a limiting factor. I have experimented with nitro....I don't think it is a good idea to run more than about 10% in these engines. A lot more variables come in to play when you start running nitro, too.
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  #18  
Old 11-03-09,, 11:38 AM
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pro69nova pro69nova is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Proprolyne Oxide works great, mix it a about 32oz per 3 gallons on 100 octane.
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  #19  
Old 11-03-09,, 12:15 PM
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Old as dirt Old as dirt is offline
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Re: fuel additives

That Prop Oxide is some really bad stuff for you and the others around breathing it.. nitromethane is as well, produces nitric acid and that will stop someone from breathing easily.. please be careful about using this kind of stuff to "go faster".. there are better, safer ways..
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  #20  
Old 11-03-09,, 04:25 PM
Oldschool Oldschool is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Lots of things you can add to fuel and make the bike faster.

If you armour all the seat you can make the bike seem faster with far less risks........
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  #21  
Old 11-03-09,, 07:08 PM
grits grits is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldschool
Lots of things you can add to fuel and make the bike faster.

If you armour all the seat you can make the bike seem faster with far less risks........


You guys talk about nitro like it's out to get you.
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  #22  
Old 11-03-09,, 07:27 PM
Oldschool Oldschool is offline
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Re: fuel additives

I swear by armor all....

I have done several seats for people and they all come back saying man that ----- is fast now what did you do to it?

When I was a young gaffer I tried all kinds of things in fuel. My Dad usualy noted the changes in the lawn and quality of the cut.
Much swearing and slaps behind the head would follow when the mower developed a problem, the grass died or patches of poorly cut grass indicated I was running through the deap stuff trying to aply some load.

There realy is no replacement for displacement I discovered and never added any fuel enhancers opting for larger engines......
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  #23  
Old 11-03-09,, 07:31 PM
65ShelbyClone 65ShelbyClone is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldschool
I swear by armor all....

I have done several seats for people and they all come back saying man that ----- is fast now what did you do to it?


Because afterward it's a lot easier to slide off the back?
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  #24  
Old 11-03-09,, 07:33 PM
Oldschool Oldschool is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Yes.....

Dear old Dad introduced me to armor all on the seats of snow machines as way keeping nags from coming back complaining there sleds weren't as fast as they used to be.
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  #25  
Old 11-05-09,, 11:33 AM
Rcrguy24 Rcrguy24 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

So has anybody run nitromethane mixed with 93 octane pump gas? if this is possible how much would it take to see a noticable power difference?
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  #26  
Old 11-05-09,, 01:25 PM
65ShelbyClone 65ShelbyClone is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Yeah it's possible, but like has been said already, you have to richen the jetting accordingly.

I would love to play with the stuff, but I just can't bring myself to buy it. $200 for a five gallon pail just hurts the wallet too much.
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  #27  
Old 11-05-09,, 04:58 PM
Oldschool Oldschool is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Nitromethane is one of those things in this day and age I just don't think its wise to buy unless you are a serious racer and have someplace secure to store it.
Its like amonia nitrate, a very useful product to a farmer but in the wrong hands its trouble and I would be concerned what happens if it got into stupid ( not just the wrong ) and the liability to the purcahser for injury or damage.

You can say that about a lot of things these days, guns, cars, pointy sticks, hell people get sued for burning themselves with a hot cup of coffee.
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  #28  
Old 11-06-09,, 10:54 AM
Michael Jackson Michael Jackson is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Nitromethane. This increases power, measured at the engine shaft, in proportion to the percentage used, limited by mechanical considerations such as compression ratio, rate of fuel flow possible in existing system.

If the engine is on the maximum compression ratio usable with race gas, this ratio will have to be dropped by a figure of one ratio if 10 percent additive used, and by half a ratio if 5 percent additive is decided upon.

With regard to the fuel flow the jet diameter will have to be increased by a figure of 1.125 for use with 10 percent, and in proportion less for the 5 percent.
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  #29  
Old 11-06-09,, 11:29 AM
Kart43 Kart43 is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Jackson
this ratio will have to be dropped by a figure of one ratio if 10 percent additive used, and by half a ratio if 5 percent additive is decided upon.




What do you mean by "a figure of one ratio", please explain further.
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  #30  
Old 11-06-09,, 12:31 PM
grits grits is offline
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Re: fuel additives

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kart43
What do you mean by "a figure of one ratio", please explain further.


For example: 12:1 down to 11:1
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